Kathleen Hanna at Rough Trade East

Kathleen Hanna In Conversation

Rough Trade East, 20 June 2024 

This was a surprise appearance only announced the day before and I made a last minute decision to pop down to Rough Trade East to hear Kathleen Hanna talk about her fantastic new book Rebel Girl! What an enlightening, funny and interesting talk it was too.

Interviewed by Deborah Frances-White of The Guilty Feminist podcast (which I must admit I'm unfamiliar with), apparently it was live-streamed for that, so it's probably online somewhere but it was fun to be in the crowd and see Hanna herself, having not just seen Bikini Kill live last week, but also, having read her excellent memoir and being genuinely sad when it ended.

Rough Trade East host a lot of in-store appearances, mainly musical performances I believe, but this was my first one. I turned up early and there was only one person in the queue when I arrived but she was wearing a Kathleen Hanna t-shirt so at least I knew I was in the right place. It wasn't long though that a really long queue emerged and it turned out the event was completely sold out.

Getting there early meant I got a nice spot at the front but I must say it took ages to start. I don't know why but when Hanna and Frances-White did make it onto the stage I did think Hanna looked absolutely pissed off so whatever was going on behind the scenes had obviously annoyed her. It took a little while for her to warm up because of this but once she did, she was honest, witty, very insightful and intelligent and filled with lots of cool stories. 

When Frances-White brought up the face Hanna had been responsible for the title of Nirvana's most famous song, Smells Like Teen Spirit, Hanna quickly countered, "I have a body of work that goes back over 30 years, I'd like to think I'm more than that," to which Frances-White immediately backtracked saying, she just thought it was a cool bit of trivia and didn't know it before she read the book, but you can tell Hanna is tired of talking about it (the recent Times interview with Hanna that puts Kurt Cobain's name in the headline must have irked her too).

Hanna spoke about being an artist, and always knowing since she was a kid that she wanted to work in the arts, firstly singing as Annie in a school production (she told an amusing story about how the school merged Annie with Oliver because a parent complained there's weren't enough roles for boys in Annie!), then studying photography at college before meeting author Kathy Acker, who told her she should start a band. She went home and formed Bikini Kill because of it!

She also spoke about feminism, an unbelievably inappropriate school councilor and about the ridiculous accusations of being a sell-out and purity in punk rock (she's right that it is a class issue totally and that middle-class white dudes can afford to never make any money from their art, in the guise of "integrity"). She stated there is nothing wrong with selling records and being on a major label, "it wasn't right for me but there is nothing wrong with wanting to make a living making music." She even said she was going to see Taylor Swift at Wembley Stadium on the weekend, "I wouldn't want to be her though". She also said the future of punk rock is not white men (absolutely!) and said it may well be someone here in this room right now. 

At the end, she asked Frances-White what her favourite misunderstood fairy tale was, and she answered it was Rapunzel and went into a long explanation about how Rapunzel is a feminist tale about society's beauty expectations of women and their long hair. Hanna laughed and said hers was Rumpelstiltskin because "all he wanted was a baby!" She seemed genuinely appalled at how badly poor old Rumpelstiltskin was treated! 

It was interesting too the age range of the audience in attendance, from people who looked like they could be in their 60s and 70s, down to a couple of little kids who seemed to be there with their mums (who was the fan, I couldn't tell, as one little girl did look like a miniature Bikini Kill fan). At a couple of points during the talk, Hanna apologised for swearing or talking about rape in front of them, but thankfully it didn't stop her from discussing important topics. She even admitted that her past traumatic experiences had left her with PDSD, as her son discovered when he one day tried to play a joke on her that left her screaming.

At the end, Frances-White asked if she had any guilty feminist stories, as is the subject of the podcast, and Hanna said she didn't believe in being a "guilty feminist" (right on!) but told a brilliant story about being part of a "Dyke march" with none other than Joan Jett, who suddenly got a hankering for some small crackers and persuaded her to make a pit stop into a deli to get some, but being Joan Jett, most the march followed her lead and the poor deli was filled with protesters as Joan Jett got her crackers.

All in all, it was a great night hearing Hanna speak and telling her stories, some from the book, but some completely new to me. What an inspiration she is!